This is your place to publicly comment on the topics and issues addressed in Speaking of Faith programs. React in a personal way, and put into words what this program meant to you.
Submit Your Reflection about "Exodus, Cargo of Hidden Stories."
Knowing the Passover Story (April 8, 2007)
I, myself, am an Episcopal deacon and was inspired in my Maundy Thursday sermon by the podcast interview on the Exodus. The night before Maundy Thursday, our church held a Seder meal, instructed by a local rabbi, and I understood the Passover as I had never quite understood it before having just listened to "Exodus, Cargo of Hidden Stories" with Avivah Zornberg.
Charles Pearce
Manhattan, KS (Listens to SOF Podcast)
It Was God, Not Pharaoh (April 3, 2007)
In the fairy-tale fiction of God/Moses, you and the author dishonestly portray God as the good guy and Pharaoh as the bad guy, reluctantly adding half-way through the discussion that God did "harden Pharaoh's heart, but only after the 'boils' curse episode" (Ex. 9:12). The text says otherwise, says in fact that even before Moses leaves for Egypt, God says: "I have hardened his heart so that he will not let the people go" (Ex. 4:21). This ego-ridden God proudly repeats this same statement in Ex. 7:3, Ex. 10:27, and continues this cruel charade even in the sea-crossing scene at the end (Ex. 14:4,8). It appalls me that supposedly religious people are unwilling to confront the serious inconsistencies, contradictions, and unethical and hurtful values so often dramatized in Judeo-Christian scripture.
John Bierk
Cape Girardeau, MO (KWMU, 90.7 FM)
Absolute Power (April 1, 2007)
One meaning that I see in the Exodus story is that the Israelites gained their own freedom from slavery and then went on to slaughter and inflict genocide on other people. It happened again with the ethnic cleansing of Palestine. But I don't want to blame only the Jews. The Christians were once persecuted, until they became the religion of Caesar. The American settlers, once persecuted, went on to nearly wipe out the Indians. As Lord Acton said, "Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely." It's true of us all.
Per Fagereng
Portland, OR (KOPB, 91.5 FM)
Presenting John's Easter (March 31, 2007)
I was immediately struck by how un-Biblical the word "Easter" is. Maybe there is a reference to it in the New Testament, but I think not. As long as you've explained the grisly aspect of plagues, with deaths of the first-born included, why not present this "Easter" segment as, Ultimate Passover - At Last, The Season of Sacrifice Where God Himself Supplies The Lamb For The Slaughter! Having said that, we must of course refer to John the Baptist's declaration in the Gospel of John, chapter 1, verse 29; "Behold the
lamb of God who takes away (rather than merely covering) the sins of the world." Now that may be food for discussion. I believe that there is a lot of meat on the bones of John's declaration.
David Eidsvaag
Litchfield, MN (KNSR, 88.9 FM)
Upcoming Events? (April 16, 2006)
On Saturday, I was having my daughter's cello restrung at our local violin-maker's shop and got into a conversation about Easter and Passover with one of the owners. She had recently attended a service at her Presbyterian church that included the participation of a cantor and ended in a seder. As a Jew in a largely non-Jewish neighborhood, I was heartened by the openness of the Presbyterian minister and his congregation, and was eager to tell Mrs. Weisshaar about Speaking of Faith, which has been a great source of pleasure and nourishment for my soul since I began tuning in to it. Her husband and son came into the room, overheard what we were talking about, and said that they'd been listening to SOF regularly for some time. Mr. Weisshaar and I agreed that we'd love to hear Ms. Tippett speak if she were appearing anywhere between San Diego and Los Angeles. (Our two families live in Orange County.) Does Ms. Tippett have any speaking engagements lined up in Southern California in the coming year? Best wishes to you all and thanks for a wonderful program.
Lisa Ness
Costa Mesa, CA (KPCC, 89.3 FM)
The Meaning of Passover (April 15, 2006)
Sometimes things just need to be said. Every year for the past several I have had deep pain on hearing the Passover story, having somehow broken the spell in my own heart about whose hand it was that provided God's deliverance of Israel from the bonds of Egypt. The story, especially given what we now know of the horrors people can be driven to by their unanswered despairs, is clearly one of how a hand of retribution rose up out of a community of slaves to commit an atrocity so horrible that the entire community was driven out of its home. It could only have happened if the Jewish caregivers to Egypt's wealthy families gave entry and instructions to a band of radicals bent on an act of unspeakable terrorism. All other elements of the story are decoration. That is what there is to atone for. That is what there is to feel crushed by. That is what takes great will and daring to transcend. That is the real source of the fairytale's promise of spiritual deliverance!
Phil Henshaw
New York, NY (WNYC, 93.9 FM)
God Hardens and Softens Hearts (April 14, 2006)
I listened to this days after my father passed away. He was 95. We reconciled after a separation of seven years. We had over seven years of life together after reconciling. We actually became best friends as well as father and daughter. I understand how "God hardens [a] heart…" If indeed the purpose of tragedy, suffering, hardship, and liberation in Exodus is a device to describe the process of changing ("opening," "softening") a heart per your show this week on Passover interpreted by Ms. Zornberg, it was timely and I thank you for it. This process of "closing" or contraction can also be understood in this context by turning to the Kabbalists who talk not only of the partnership between God and God's creation (in this case human beings) but also of tzimtzum and evokes the very creation of the world.
I agree with the listener who is concerned about "reductionism" in this mythic as well as other mythic stories in biblical literature. That being said, the softening of a "hardened" heart can be interpreted as necessary in a people's liberation from bondage. May the story of Passover be used as a means of understanding that.
LJ Rose
Oakland, CA (Listens to SOF OnDemand)
I'm Still Puzzled by This Story as a Moral Tale (April 14, 2006)
This is my favorite example of a biblical story which, in it's literal telling, is atrocious and cruel, but which has been transformed by the faithful into
something that promotes good human values. When I was 11 or 12, and first read this story (after being told cleaned-up versions), I was horrified by Exodus 4:21, where, long before Moses has spoken to Pharaoh, God assures Moses that God will prevent Pharaoh from letting the people of Israel go. And then in Exodus 7:3, 7:4, and 7:5 God repeats that he will prevent Pharaoh from letting them go, so that he (God) will have the opportunity to "lay my hand upon Egypt, and bring forth mine armies, and my people the children of Israel, out of the land of Egypt by great judgments." Throughout the rest of the tale, whenever Pharaoh decides to let the Israelites go, God forcibly changes Pharaoh's mind and then lets loose more devastation on the land of Egypt, and does disgusting things to innocent men, women, children, and animals.
As written, this is quite puzzling as a moral tale. Over the years I have asked a number of religious people how this can be taught as the actions of a moral God, and have often met either anger that I would quote the parts of the Bible that others prefer to ignore, or denial that "I will harden his heart" means "I will harden his heart" — but I've never heard a moral explanation of the actual story. Unfortunately, on today's show it was again treated as if those verses of the Bible where God hardens Pharaoh's heart were just an odd way for God to say that Pharaoh was a bad man. And God's refusal to just release the Israelites on his own, without Pharaoh's acquiescence, was not addressed at all — although one would assume that the creator of the universe would be able to transport a few thousand people from Egypt to Palestine without any fuss.
I think all of the good teachings associated with Passover and all of the liberation theology that people have taken from a selective reading of Exodus are great — but I shiver when I think of the actual story, a story of a psychotic God on a slaughtering spree, who's main goal is to show off his own strength.
E. Carpenter
New York, NY (WNYC, 93.9 FM)
Stay Clear (April 14, 2006)
The firstborn do seem to have a risky existence with this God. Doesn't he (or she) have a heavy hand with the Egyptians in this story? In fact, I would stay clear of him (or her) as you might never know when his wrath, or whimsy might strike out.
Edmund Bleich
Pearl River, NY (WNYC, 93.9 FM)
What About Christianity? (April 13, 2006)
This "Passion" week being one of two of the most important events in Christianity, why is there no mention of Easter in this week's radio conversation on faith? I absolutely respect the Jewish foundation of Christianity, and would like to have recognition for a religion that is the foundation of the religious freedom in our country today, including freedom for the Jews.
Patricia Boll
D'Hanis, TX (Listens to SOF OnDemand)
Emptiness (May 14, 2005)
The strongest recurring event that shaped my feelings and sparked my thoughts, and led me to try to become the person I would have liked to be, was the Seder at Passover that my father led, with support from my mother, for me, my brother, my three sisters, and any guest any of my siblings or I invited. I have tried, and frequently failed, to be guided by the basic message of Passover, "…you shall know the heart of a stranger, for we were strangers in the land of Egypt." My life now is fractured in many ways and I feel unable to recapture the wholeness (a wholeness that probably did not exist) of that time. When I listen to your program, the strong yearning for the past that it evokes brings me closer to my past and is calming. Thank you.
Victor Haim Besson
New York City, NY (WNYC, 820 AM)
Absurdity and No-naming G-d (May 14, 2005)
I found Avivah Zornberg's commentary on the Exodus story interesting, but what I found very illuminating was her reminder of the absurdity of Moses being given a directive by the commander of all commanders and thinking it was perfectly appropriate to argue with the holy one and his direction! When one reads or hears of the Exodus story, the first reaction is to think it to be perfectly normal to engage in the kind of conversation we have with our friends, family, and co-workers — to justify our interpretation of our identity and to explain why we act as we must. We forget that in this story, such an audience does not exist. We forget that the command given is not subject to OUR interpretation. It is simply to be carried out and to let the consequences fall as they will.
So on one level, we see the absurdity in the act by a mortal and fallible being to convince the holy one which is beyond cause and effect to buy into another point of view — to believe that doubt, fear, limitation carries more weight than certainty and transcendental power. On the other hand, as is inherent in Talmudic thought, even if "the other" IS "THE other" (in the holiest sense), it is acceptable, allowed, and normal to engage in discussion and argument. The purpose is to work through our "material" so that we not only do what is asked of us but to do so with an understanding gained by engaging with "The Other."
The discussion on the name of G-d which Moses hears was illuminating also. Everything has a name. But as Avivah Zornberg stated, names create a "hook," something we can grab onto. The G-d that is to be known is that which represents the principle of becoming. That principle, of possibility, of creation, of impermanence reminded me of some of the ideas on the nature of the universe as stated in Buddhist thought and quantum physics. Ms. Zornberg's explanation of the nature of G-d as illuminated by the interaction of Moses with G-d is perhaps one of the key points of the entire story: "I am not who you think I am, nor will you ever know as you know other living beings to be."
Rick Kantor
Philadelphia, PA (WHYY, 91.0 FM)
A Driveway Moment with My Son (April 26, 2005)
Hello, I've been listening to public radio for many years, mostly during the weekday rush hours, but also on the weekends and I often have "driveway moments." On our way home from hockey practice, I told my 6-year-old son that I was going to turn on the radio. You see, listening to the radio with him in the car has been a challenge lately as he prefers it quiet. I think he's just testing his independence and authority and he thinks of the car as his space, not mine and not ours.
To my surprise, this time I had no objection and I turned the radio on to my favorite station, KWMU. The Speaking of Faith program on Passover was just beginning and the introduction really sparked my interest. Since we had just had our Passover Seder the night before, the story of Passover was fresh in our minds and I was very interested in hearing the discussion on the show. I had been listening for about five minutes or so when I realized that my son was also quietly listening. As we turned into our subdivision he said, "Mommy, can we stay in the car when we get home so we can hear the rest of the story?"
I was so incredibly DELIGHTED! Well, we didn't stay in the car, and instead we quickly rushed into the house and turned the radio on in the kitchen and listened as we sat to have a late breakfast. It was so wonderful and we really enjoyed the story. And we talked about it and he asked questions. I thought it was just as fascinating as the Torah Study I occasionally attend with my Rabbi and I felt like I was having a wonderful Torah Study with my son. I hope you like this story, my "driveway moment" with my 6-year-old as much as I do. Thank you.
Sharol Brickman
St. Louis, MO (KWMU, 90.7 FM)
Themes of Exodus in Magnolia (April 25, 2005)
I apologize as this isn't a well thought out email. And it will make absolutely no sense to someone who has not seen the movie Magnolia! Admittedly, your show was only on in the background at first, but I was pulled in. I have tried to find ties to the movie Magnolia and the Bible. When the movie came out (six years ago??) I watched it in the theater and continued to pine over it for weeks — and I suppose now years — to come. The movie flashes hints of scripture: hoses suspiciously in the shape of numbers, a reference to Exodus 8:2 (if I can remember correctly) on a bus stop shelter, and I'm sure there were many other hidden clues.
Obviously, though, there was the plague of frogs. I was
unaware of such a thing until I got home after watching
the movie and read Exodus. I went nuts! I spent the next
day mapping out the movie: who may have been the Pharaoh,
Moses, etc., or if I was even on the right track! Years
later, I hear your program! The conversation seemed to
be right on the mark for the movie, as well. The telling
of the stories, the songs at the edge of mortality, etc.
I briefly looked up Magnolia on the Web just now,
and found nothing to help my curiosity. I know I could
be on the wrong track completely about all of this, but
if anyone there has any ideas, please let me know! It
was a very thoughtful show tonight and I will be sure
to listen in again.
Brooke Wilkinson
Lebanon, NH (WVPR, 89.5 FM)
What's the Meaning for Other Groups? (April 25, 2005)
I find it disturbing that this program was broadcast with no representation at all of the meaning that it might have had for the Egyptians. We are treated to
the story of a god who, while he had power over all, chose to devote his interest only to the people of Israel. I would like to hear Speaking of Faith address the issue of the exclusivity of most of the major religions of the world. Are we to assume that all the first-born of Egypt deserved to die for the sins of Pharaoh while the first-born of Israel were passed over? What kind of message does this send? Why did the God of Israel not care about all the other peoples of the world? I am very disturbed by this aspect of your program. You do not approach the point of view of persons like myself who, while devoutly spiritual, have no time whatsoever for the established religions of the world.
James McKain
Shrewsbury, VT (WVPR, 89.5 FM)
Too Little Zornberg, Poor Timing on Holiday! (April 25, 2005)
Avivah Zornberg is truly one of the great treasures of contemporary Jewish thought. I wish she had simply had the hour to offer a shiur, a lesson, in her
magnificent and unique style which weaves together old and new, tradition and new insight. The program was welcome and thoughtful, but not nearly what it might have been, which was so sad. Also disappointing was the decision to air it on Sunday April 24 when observant Jews would not listen to the radio as it was the first day of Passover. I wish you had aired it last week, and then done a different program this week. (Of course anyone may listen online at any time, which is most welcome.) But THANK YOU for bringing Avivah Zornberg to the air — even a little bit, and even maybe not on the best date.
C. Barnard
Chicago, IL (WBEZ, 91.5 FM)
Two Jews on the Rim of Passover (April 24, 2005)
The Exodus story is re-told every year, in much the same way. Last night, at a seder I was attending, someone asked if the story relates at all to us in our every day lives. Listening to your program this morning, I thought more on this and wrote the following:
A true story: I am in Lund?s, which I am never in, looking for the whole wheat matzo that I can?t live without at Passover. I also need dessert to bring to my host and hostess?s seders. Whatever they have is not where it was last year; I am stumped, and spying a smallish woman who appears to be milling around the Passover grape juice section, I look down at her, hopefully. She looks up at me, smiling, and I take the plunge: Do you know where the Passover matzos are?
She knows. With a sweeping gesture, she indicates the aisle where everything is stored this year. They seem to be expanding their stash of Passover goods. That suits me fine. Turns out the woman I am talking with is Russian. We end up chatting for 15 minutes between the chocolate seder plates and the Kedem grape juices. She asks me if I prepare for the holiday "in the traditional way." I tell her I do. For me, that means cleaning, scrubbing, scouring, shifting plates from downstairs to upstairs and vice versa, and getting rid of every leavened crumb I can lay my eyes on. Why do I do it?
She tells me the answer without knowing it. ?My mother,? she says, in a thick Russian accent, ?used to bake her matzos in secret, in the middle of the night, and stored them in a hole in our kitchen floor.? I don?t need to ask her why, but she tells me anyway. ?In Russia, we are not allowed to practice religion. But when I think of it now, my mother would never eat any bread during the holiday, but we — her children — ate it in school. She used to ask us to save some of the matzo for her but we ate a lot of it and if she didn?t have enough for the whole eight days, she went without it. Now when I think of it, I want to cry.?
So we go on, she and I, to our separate ways, two days before the holiday. I know that the next day I will have to come home after working all day and start cleaning. I know that in two days my breaded days are over. And my mouth is watering already, for the bread I won?t have. I am doing this, why? Because my mother, and her mother, and all the generations I can possibly imagine and can?t imagine centuries before they were born did it. Because as a friend once said when I sat at his seder table, Jewish people have survived centuries of oppression because no matter what they say or do to us, we keep our traditions.
Because eating matzo for eight days gives me a new way to talk to G-d. It doesn?t involve prayer, which is beautiful, but ethereal; it involves an action I can take, a taste in my mouth, that cannot be duplicated in any other way. Because when I sit down for the first seder, every single year since I?ve been a child, I get a feeling of being lifted up, and floating, and it stays with me all night through. Because Judaism is not so much about language, or prayers, or ideas, as it is about the sanctification of small things, the things we do in our homes, when we are eating, and getting ready for bed, and getting ready to work, and talking to each other. Because Passover encompasses the sanctification of all these things in a single week.
Because this Russian lady had to hide her matzo in a hole in the floor. And I can eat it in the office where I work. Because if my son didn?t have the experience of matzo and seder, I would have been guilty of a kind of child abuse. Because of all these things, I will go and scrub and wipe and lift and tote and get ready for Passover. And my heart, like the hearts of others might be when it is two days before Christmas or Easter, will be light. So to all Jews reading this and all those not reading it — and to all those who love and celebrate with us. Happy Passover!
Jenna Zark
St. Paul, MN (KNOW, 91.1 FM)
Unlocking the Hidden Stories (April 24, 2005)
Thank you for an excellent and introspective program on the Passover. I believe that Passover, for a non-Jew, is best understood in the broader metaphor of ?life?s journey." Why are we here, at the time, place, and age we are at (a central question in human history)? How does being "here" edify us and challenge us to reflect on the process of continuing that journey.
As the program so aptly pointed out, the heart of the Passover is the admonition to doubt and question, for in doing so we attain a renewed awareness of ourselves as players in life?s complexity. If God seeks anything in us, I believe, it is to "doubt" and question our understanding of the on-going relationship to the ever-present "other" in and around us. Questioning therefore is the key to unlocking those "hidden stories" in all of us. Peace.
Thomas Lifvendahl
Milwaukee, WI (WUWM, 89.7 FM)
Not an Overt Political Story (April 24, 2005)
One of the aspects of the Exodus story that I would have
liked to have heard addressed today pertains to liturgy
and worship. At Exodus 3:18, I think it is, the original
intent of Moses' request that Pharaoh let the Israelites
go is so that they can journey three days into the wilderness
to worship God. There's no overt political message of
freedom from oppression or psychological message of liberating
the person to be fully human, or some such thing. Rather,
Moses was not looking to free the Israelites "from" anything,
as much as he was wanting — at God's prompting — to
free them "to" something: to worship.
This facet of the Exodus story is hardly ever remarked on. Of course, as it turns out, the repeated hardening of Pharaoh's heart resulted in the Israelites being freed from bondage and in their plundering the Egyptians, a motif that would be picked up later by Augustine and others as the incipient church looked upon the classical-pagan ethos out of which it sprang. Still, I think the rush to make the Exodus story into something pertaining to political or psychological freedom, while not "wrong" per se, is a bit reductionistic.
Albert Petitie
Philadelphia, PA (WHYY, 91.0 FM)
Exodus from Gaza (April 24, 2005)
As a spiritual "voyeur" I found the Exodus interview especially compelling when one views the difficulty of the Jews being forced to leave Gaza, which is G-d given land to the Jewish people of faith. Thank you for the programming.
Alan Cahn
Lincolnwood, IL (WBEZ, 91.5 FM)
The Role of Women in the Exodus Story (April 21, 2005)
I heard that this Sunday's program will focus on the Exodus story. While it is probably pre-recorded I would hope that the story brings out the role of women in the Exodus story. Five women played a key role in that story: Moses' mother, his sister Miriam, two midwives Shiphrah and Puah, and the Pharaoh's daughter. Moses' mother engaged in civil disobedience even endangering her family. The midwives defied the law of Pharaoh. These women were resisters, who refused to be oppressed. Pharaoh's daughter not only went against civil law, but against her own father and joined these other women in a conspiracy. Miriam stood by watching out for her brother. Later she led the people in ritual dance and prayer after crossing the Red Sea. She is named "Prophetess" — a term given her before the term prophet was given to Moses. These women came together crossing barriers of religion, social and economic positions, and race to work for justice. They are wonderful role models whose stories are so rarely told. Without their courage there would have been no Moses.
Richelle Pearl-Koller
Minneapolis, MN (KNOW, 91.1 FM)
